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Ephedrine should not be banned (personal opinion)
2003-07-30 07:20:30
First, an anecdotal story (not originally part of this post):
Pharmacies in Louisville, KY will actually lie to customers and tell them ephedrine is illegal. The last time I visited a chain store pharmacy here in Louisville, the druggist did not do as many Louisville pharmacists do - say outright that it is illegal - but he said he thought it was illegal, did not have any in stock and he did not know any distributor in Louisville which kept it in stock. Imagine, all this information right off the top of his head! I was enraged by his condescendence but did not let on. I thanked him (only semi-sarcastically) and calmly left his store. I then went home and called the Louisville office of the DEA. I asked to speak with an agent about ephedrine and asked for his name and asked him for permission to quote him later. I explained my situation and why I take ephedrine. Then I asked him to fax the current law regarding ephedrine in the state of Kentucky. The DEA agent was friendly, understood my concern, and he faxed me the law regarding ephedrine in Kentucky at that point in time (circa 2000). As soon as I got the DEA's fax I called the national headquarters of the chain drugstore I visited earlier. I asked for the name of the person in charge of the Kentucky pharmacies, then when this person came to the phone I explained to her everything I explained to the DEA, got her fax number, and faxed her all of the information I received from the DEA. `Lo and behold, in less than 20 minutes, the local pharmacist whom I spoke with earlier in the day called me and he was extremely apologetic. He said he got very few legitimate requests for ephedrine and he was not entirely certain of the status of the law, he only thought it was illegal and he only thought he could not order it for me. He told me he was aware I had spoken with his supervisor and she informed him of the status of the law and that he could, should, and would order it for me. It arrived the next day. The pharmacist obviously thought he was talking to a drug crazed country bumpkin. I only relate this story because ephedrine has gotten a bad name and pharmacists think people who want to buy it only want it for illegitimate purposes. It takes a very unfair effort to counter this sometimes erroneous belief. = = = = = = = = = = = = = = = Original newsgroup post: There is a public propelled movement going on to get products containing ma huang (ephedra) or ephedrine products (e.g., ephedrine hydrochloride [HCL]) off the market. In part this is understandable only in regard to the fact the Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) has determined that ephedrine is one precursor of methamphetamine (speed), meaning that large quantities of the substance ephedrine are used by people running illegal laboratories to make illegal substances like methamphetamine for sale and personal gain. The DEA has declared the sale of large quantities of unadulterated ephedrine illegal, quantities which are many times larger than one person could legitimately consume in a month (or even longer). I support this regulation and fully approve of the DEA's efforts to keep amphetamines off the streets and out of any child's possession. I will not speak of ma huang (ephedra) because I do not use it; for my need it does not work. I am only writing to speak of ephedrine hlc and the fact many states are banning the drug. I suspect the federal government will follow suit as well within the next five to ten years. Why are they trying to ban it? It is not because kids are trying to make methamphetamine in their basement --- the allowable quantities for sale are far too small for that sort of thing. The reason is because ephedrine has very strong stimulant effects, almost as strong as amphetamine (in those with zero tolerance of the drug). If people do not read the instructions on the label (one 25mg tablet every four hours, not to exceed six tablets in 24 hours) and if they take excess amounts to realize the potent stimulant effects of the drug - doing this, and not following the instructions can kill people with defective cardiovascular physiology. This has happened in the United States and other countries a very small number of times, but every time this happens the news media creates huge media publicity (ala Don Henley's "Dirty Laundry") and as a result many people incorrectly assume that ephedrine is even more toxic than pure nicotine (one of the most toxic poisons around), or for that matter, ordinary aspirin. If people do not read the instructions on any medicine bottle, regardless of whether it is a prescription drug or OTC (over the counter) serious adverse effects can and do occur. For example, the Uchee Pines Institute (http://www.ucheepines.org/pain_and_fever.htm) says: * Aspirin is a major cause of death in children up to 6 years of age, accounting for more than 500 deaths from overdoses each year. * About 10,000 Americans each year lose their lives because of taking aspirin. These deaths are entirely separate from accidental overdose in children. The Pittsburgh Post-Gazette (http://www.post-gazette.com/healthscience /20030422hpainpills1.asp) states: * McNeil officials testified that Tylenol and other forms of acetaminophen are safe if used as directed. They noted that about 100 deaths from accidental acetaminophen overdose are reported annually. The Post-Gazette also reports that when all OTC pain killers including aspirin are considered: * [A]n estimated 160,000 Americans end up in hospital emergency rooms and about 16,000 die from complications related to the use of OTC painkillers. On the other hand a lawyer related website http://www.ephedrine-ephedra.com/ states [in the entire recent history of the marketing of ephedrine or ephedrine-based products]: * The FDA believes that ephedra may be related to more than 50 deaths. Most of the serious injuries involve high blood pressure that can cause bleeding in the brain, a stroke or a heart attack. What they fail to mention is the fact the drugs are taken in excess of the directions on the label; they are also taken by people with weak hearts. Why is this of any concern to me? It is of concern to me for the very reason stated on the bottle of "Mini-thins" sitting on my desk: [Ephedrine] is a bronchodilator and it helps breathing without drowsiness. Why should this matter to me? I was a smoker from age 13 to age 34. Smoking had affected my breathing drastically and I was on the verge of developing emphysema. Even after I quit smoking, from age 34 until my present age of 52, I have a lot of trouble breathing on high ozone days which frequently occur on hot days in the summer months. Lacking health insurance and distaining long waits in public health clinics, I try to self-medicate whenever the medications to do so are available over the counter. One day I was in a convenience store and I saw a display of Mini-Thins (ephedrine HCL 25mg. tablets) for sale. I read on the package "helps breathing without drowsiness," and decided to try it. It worked. It still works. It is wonderful and I can breathe easily and I have avoided a $120 initial visit doctor bill as well as expensive prescription medications. I have been taking ephedrine regularly, AS DIRECTED, for almost two decades with no adverse effects. Not only that, but heart disease is rampant in my family and despite my use of ephedrine for nearly twenty years, I am in good physical health at age fifty-two and it is my considered belief that my use of ephedrine products, taken as directed, do not cause any harm whatsoever. Abuse any drug and you may suffer negative consequences - be it aspirin, other OTC pain killers, or even ephedrine - but do not punish the educated and well-read on account of the misinformed and/or illiterates. An illiterate cannot read "Walk / Don't Walk" signs either, yet we do not put a uniformed traffic director on every corner. Educate yourself before you attempt to pass laws and ban products without any conception of what you are doing or why you are doing it. Aspirin killed many more children last year than ephedrine did in the entire course of recent history. Why don't you work to ban aspirin? Why? Because you like it and it helps you? Well, did you ever stop to consider ephedrine may help some people too? Think about it and let me know your thoughts on this. I am interested in hearing what intelligent well-read people have to say on this subject. Tony Safina Louisville, Kentucky (vicinity) tony@igloo.com Change igloo to iglou to email me directly (and help keep spam out of my mailbox) Thanks. = = = = = Only as an afterthought did I send this poating to the FDA's CDER public ombudsman. He wrote back and told me I had made some excellent arguments and he would forward my message to the relevant idividuals. I wrote him back and thanked him immediately (for not being like that Kentucky pharmacist I mentioned at the start of this post.)
2003-07-30 10:34:07
"Tony Safina" wrote in message <34d5abcd.0307300620.6c7dff4@posting.google.com>...
>There is a public propelled movement going on to get products >containing ma huang (ephedra) or ephedrine products (e.g., ephedrine >hydrochloride [HCL]) off the market. In part this is understandable >only in regard to the fact the Drug Enforcement Agency (DEA) has >determined that ephedrine is one precursor of methamphetamine (speed), >meaning that large quantities of the substance ephedrine are used by >people running illegal laboratories to make illegal substances like >methamphetamine for sale and personal gain. The DEA has declared the >sale of large quantities of unadulterated ephedrine illegal, >quantities which are many times larger than one person could >legitimately consume in a month (or even longer). I support this >regulation and fully approve of the DEA's efforts to keep amphetamines >off the streets and out of any child's possession. There is no reason to ban ephedrine just because it is a precursor to methamphetamine. Pseudoephedrine is identical to ephedrine, simply a mirror image, and can just as easily be used to manufacture meth. Pseudoephedrine is found in just about every OTC cold/sinus medication imaginable and there is no way in hell the government will ever ban it. Pseudoephedrine is also a powerful stimulant (though not comparable to meth) when taken in large doses (I just took a shitload in 8oz of DXM cough syrup and my heart pounded so hard I thought I would have a heart attack). If ephedrine is banned people will simply switch to pseudoephedrine.
2003-07-31 00:35:47
"Tony Safina" news:34d5abcd.0307300620.6c7dff4@posting.google.com... > `Lo and behold, in less than 20 minutes, the local pharmacist whom I > spoke with earlier in the day called me and he was extremely > apologetic. He said he got very few legitimate requests for ephedrine > and he was not entirely certain of the status of the law, he only > thought it was illegal and he only thought he could not order it for > me. He told me he was aware I had spoken with his supervisor and she > informed him of the status of the law and that he could, should, and > would order it for me. It arrived the next day. You go!!! Thanks for the post.
2003-07-31 02:18:39
> There is no reason to ban ephedrine just because it is a precursor > to methamphetamine. Pseudoephedrine is identical to ephedrine, > simply a mirror image, and can just as easily be used to manufacture > meth. They are planning to ban the sale of pure ephedrine, im sure psuedo will be included with any planned regulations.
2003-07-31 15:33:27
On Thu, 31 Jul 2003 02:18:39 GMT, While I was using pressure to stop the
bleeding, BilZ0r . > >> There is no reason to ban ephedrine just because it is a precursor >> to methamphetamine. Pseudoephedrine is identical to ephedrine, >> simply a mirror image, and can just as easily be used to manufacture >> meth. > >They are planning to ban the sale of pure ephedrine, im sure psuedo will be >included with any planned regulations. I doubt it. The political reasons for banning ephedrine will be served by banning it alone.
2003-08-24 00:14:38
"Poop Dogg"
> There is no reason to ban ephedrine just because it is a precursor > to methamphetamine. Pseudoephedrine is identical to ephedrine, There is no reason to take ephedrine or ephedra except to get high, preferably when its made into meth. As an herb, ephedra is dangerous. It consumes your yin and is only used to release the exterior (dont ask) for short term under observation. When the government realizes this (if they had the capability to comprehend concepts in chinese medicine), it will be most likely be banned. At least blocked for import. Then, it joins the fate of quite a few other chinese herbs. They put muxiang on a watchlist for "arsenic". Bullcrap. You'd have to eat literally pounds of it to die of arsenic. Its probably really because you could get a kind of narcotic high from smoking it. ordosclan@mail.hongkong.com |
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